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[Chuck Burnett]

This is a free test run of a video hosting service I'm trying.

Here's a brief slashing demo from a recent firearms tactics course.
Raw beef wrapped around PVC vs. a dollar store razor knife and a $12 CRKT Ryan Plan "B" fixed blade.

http://www.mydeo.com/videorequest.asp?XID=5132&CID=42568
This should stream in Windows Video Player.

Chuck

[kamagong]

Interesting!  Got to see it without sound.  Liked the PVC pipe for bone thing,  I guess it would make a nice "thunk" that would get peoples attention if you told them this represented bone, and it cut all the way to the pipe. 

[410indashade]

I hate to interrupt the fantasy that a hunk of raw beef hung on PVC pipe somehow represents the human body.  It's the same trap the erstwhile, " close combat expert" Lenny Mcgill fell into in one of his DVD's.  Living tissue just doesn't behave the same way as exposed dead muscle tissue.  For one thing, you have to get past the skin and connective tissue.  For another thing your target will probably be trying to avoid getting cut or stabbed.  And lastly but not least unless you catch a target in his/her underwear or summer wear the point you want to cut will probably be covered by clothing.  In his "Power of The Blade" DVD Lenny at least tried dealing with this last thing by covering his "meat man" with various articles of clothing.  Let's just say clothing presents a problem that Lenny proposes to solve by using stabbing motions only, lots of them.  Not something I recommend with most folding knives on the market.   

[Chuck Burnett]

Wow, 410indashade, thanks for putting me in my place.
I just didn't think about skin stopping that razor blade. Maybe I should get an air hammer like surgeons use to cut people open.

And my opponent is going to be moving?  Crap, back to the drawing board.

So basically, that contact cut while gripping the "wrist" isn't going to have much effect on a real person? Dammit!

And notwithstanding the 105 degree weather here in Vegas, heavy clothing is going to be a deal killer? Shit!

Geez, you'd think I was just trying to remind some gun guys that small sharp blades demand respect beyond dojo pattycake.

 

Chuck (Not even Lenny Magill level)

[Hock]

These are just fun, trial run tests, dating way back, not RAND lab tests, Harvard med school exams or ol' Pancho Villa and Samaria tests-you know what they are? Using real people, although the katana makers worked on fresh dead bodies for their best tests.

Vunak was the first I can remember to cut (and chew once!) raw meat on film in the 80s, yet I seem to recall someone else doing meat cuts before that?  Then there was Lenny McGill and his "meat man." Then to follow suit on film, Mike Janitch of Paladin.

I wrapped some meat on my war post arms once and put on it some differing clothes
,...shirt...sweatshirt and then put two kinds of jackets over the shirts. I even put blue jeans on the arms, not the best test of jeans -protecting-legs, but my warpost had no legs. (the jeans did very little to stop a knife.

Non-direct slashes (which are like many chaotic slashes) like 10 degree to 70 and on the other side, would cut to the meat too, but not each time, and not as deep as some of 80 to 90 to 100 degree dedicated, perfect angle cuts as some of the angles tended to move the top layer of clothes more than directly land.

Once in awhile, against two layers of clothes, indirect, off-angle knife slashes did not cut meat and actually moved the upper layer of clothes.

I hear tell that many of such slashes do not instantly hurt. A small paper cut on parts of your hands may hurt more. Adrenaline has somethign to do with that. The slash that incapacitates body functions, like on a muscle, is a better goal than getting pain. And of course, blood loss or an UGLY wound that the opponent can look at and get instant mental shock is good too.

Anyway, it is always cool to cut meat as an experiment and "feel" the cut (it is good to punch meat too, as the old boxers do).

Hock

[Chuck Burnett]

(it is good to punch meat too, as the old boxers do).

Mmmm. Tender steak.

Chuck

[410indashade]

Once in good/bad old days I was temporarily stationed at Nellis AFB so, yeah I know the weather in Las Vegas and points North in Neveda.  Tell me, do the high rollers and wannabes still wear stylish leather coats and crocodile cowboy boots or something similar.  How about the leather hats and vests on the junkies and whores down on 2nd Street or whereever their hanging out know?  You don't honestly believe razors won't come into play if one of them decides business is too slow and mugs a tourista who wanders of the beaten path?  Oh, by the way Hock and Chuck I mean this as no-put down or criticism just a helpful suggestion from one who has seen that particular elephant and didn't get ran over by it.  Next time you try cutting trials on meat put an unlined sleeve of an old leather jacket over it and let your target swing free at one end.  No fair using full serrated blades.  A half serrated blade is acceptable.  Now see how you do?  I have a little experience in going knife against knife and I can tell you the practice can't be made too difficult.