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[SIGnoramus]

I am looking for opinions on Combat Hapkido as taught by John Pellegrini and the ICHF. That is, I am looking for opinions on the system itself and NOT Mr. Pellegrini. I am well aware of Mr. Pellegrini's history and all of the b.s. that seems to manifest itself whenever someone mentions his name on the internet.

As some of you know, I have some health issues I'm dealing with, but I have begun to work toward getting back into shape and am looking to start training again. I recently started working Hock's Training Mission One material, and I have a partner here in N.C. that is interested in starting a SFC training group. My intention is to progress in the SFC material as far as possible and to teach that material one day. Having said that, I am looking to do some additional training to supplement my daily weight and cardio workouts.

I have always been intrigued by Mr. Pellegrini himself and his system, as I studied traditional Korean MA when I was younger. I like the fact that he developed a system that does not use some of the flashier techniques that, IMO, aren't as useful in real world situations. For those of you who have first-hand experience with Combat Hapkido, either through seminars or classes, how would you say it meshes with Hock's material? Can a recovering fat-ass like myself expect to be able to FULLY participate in a typical class? While I realize that I will never be 100% happy with any single instructor or system, Combat Hapkido appears to be one of the better options in my area.

Any opinions on this will be greatly appreciated, and I especially would like to hear from Hock and JimH.

SIGnoramus

[JimH]

I am a student of Hapkido and Combat Hapkido.
Combat hapkido is useable and doable by anyone,young ,old,male,female in shape and or out of shape.
The Core art of combat Hapkido is HAPKIDO,we learn Hapkido ,Combat hapkido has changed soem of the traditional moves which are deemed not very street effective by most.
Examples:
It does not advocate High Kicks
It does not advocate high throws
It is geared to be ,and is,a street usable self defense
It also has aspects of other arts added with the main one being  JKD/Wing Chun inclusion of Passing,trapping,interception

Combat Hapkido also has a Ground survival portion/seperate from the main course
It also has Pressure Point,seperate from the main course
it has an FMA portion,seperate from the main course
courses which are seperate are training which is available to all through seminars and or specialized training with the instructors.
Some instructors of the various schools have trained in and include these training concepts together with the CH  program.

A lot of people also bad mouth GMP but he is a legit TKD Master Instructor and has been ranked as a Master instructor under GM Myung and has been a student of GM In Sun Seo since leaving GM Myung and forming the ICHF.

My instructor knew GMP Before the ICHF was formed ,when they were all students under Myung.
GM P used to tour with myung as a Master level Instructor and teach seminars with Myung.
My instructor has video of Myung Introducing GM P at several seminars long before the ICHF.

There is a section on GMP and the ICHF on this site,you can find it and read about it through the search button.

I hope I have answered your questions ,if you have others just post them and I will do my best to answer them and help you out.

[SIGnoramus]

JimH,

Thanks for your reply. I am somewhat knowledgeable about the curriculum for the ICHF as I own some instructional and curriculum DVDs from them. I actually spoke with Mr. Pellegrini on the phone when the ICHF was headquartered here in N.C. He came across as a very likable man, and I'm sure he is a very knowledgeable person. I have read much about him on the 'net, but we all know what kinds of information show up about him from those who are uninformed or jealous for one reason or another. If he wasn't providing services and products that thousands of people want, he wouldn't be where he is today.

The reason I wanted input from you and Hock, specifically, was the question of integration with Hock's material. I realize I will get from my training what I put into it, but the weapons program (based on what I've seen) and other aspects of the ICHF curriculum are quite different form what Hock teaches. I guess I don't want to be working against myself trying to integrate two approaches that won't mesh well.

I know you have studied various systems of self-defense and combatives and I assume that you integrate other techniques into your Combat Hapkido. Any thoughts on that particular part of your training will be greatly appreciated.

SIGnoramus

[JimH]

Sig,
Combat Hapkido is interchangable with Hock's materials and other materials,add or subtract as you like.
Many of those who come to Combat Hapkido are already instructors in other ,varied ,arts and they find it CH mixes well with what they do and teach.

If you have Hocks unarmed series and or Joe Hubbards street self defense and contractor series you will see many similarities between their materials and what you see on the ICHF unarmed series.

You speak of the ICHF weapons series,which ones are you speaking of ?
There is:
short stick
Cane
FMA stick and Knife by J Meligrito
Gun and knife disarms

Again there are many similarities and some differences,when you train the techniques you will find what works and what does not work for you and this is the important part,what works for you.
If you train using the various DVD's with a partner you can develop a good set of skills based on the various materials.

Look at what WW does  as he combines his various past studies, he introduces the scenarios and they work them and find what is good and what fits their needs as responses to threat.

Good luck

Again ,any questions and I will try to help answer them.

[SIGnoramus]

You speak of the ICHF weapons series,which ones are you speaking of ?

JimH,

The weapons material that I have seen has mostly been by Mr. Pellegrini. Some of the more traditional knife-passing drills, etc., look questionable to me, but I have yet to "pressure test" them, and I won't pass final judgment until I do so. I do remember doing knife drills in my TKD days that actually had you step over a knife-bearing hand, etc., and I don't want to get back into crap like that. I guess I am leery of trying to pass a knife in general, but I've seen Michael Janich be pretty convincing with it so, as I said, I'll reserve judgment until I've done my own drills with it. Most of the gun disarms that I have seen Mr. Pellegrini do have been very similar to other systems I've seen. I have not seen any of Mr. Melegrito's ICHF material, but I have seen some of his PMAA stuff.

Basically, I know that making all of this stuff work is up to me. I just want to be sure that I'm not trying to combine oil and water. Thank you for taking the time to answer my questions. You've been a great help.

SIGnoramus

[Hock]

Passing a knife?

Look at it this way. You are attacked by a guy with a knife. You throw a lamp at the guy's head. A good one! He stumbles. Bleeds from the head.

He slashes. You dodge, but as you do, you stick a finger in his eye.
Ouch! He tries a stab,
You dodge and kick him hard in the knee.
He is blind in one eye, his head and knee are busted open.

He stabs yet again!
Think you might deflect/pass the stab now? YUP! Because it was not the first event of a fight. It was the fifth event. The attacker is diminished. As a result, knowing how to pass and deflect is an important skill. Just as important is knowing when to use it!

This is what I call "The Myth of the First Event." People evaluating and "pressure testing" tactics and forgetting the diminished fighter theory (and, you can't "pressure test" a nose break or a knee break.)

Pressure testing is a very, VERY tricky term. An abused term. It is often used by young rookies in this business to foolishly throw out very viable tactics -

"We pressure tested that arm bar and we couldn't do it."

Oh? Did you break the guy's nose first? That's my definition of pressure testing.

Mike Janich does a lot of arts drills and without the constant explanation of how and perhaps more importantly WHEN small parts of drills have a real application, ALL drills get a certain disrespect and misunderstanding. I have never seen a single Janich film so he may explain all that - I really don't know - but it gets cut out of things like  youtube clips, or said in an intro tape and not repeated over and over again in subsequent ones?

Hock


  

[SIGnoramus]

Hock,

I really appreciate your input here. I have read your post "The 3 Deadly Myths in
Unarmed Versus Knife Fighting" elsewhere on this forum, but I seem to still be programmed in the ways of my earlier training. I am definitely working on deprogramming some of that stuff, and I appreciate your reminder that I have a LOT of work to do in that area.

Based on what you and JimH have posted, along with the fact that I've always been interested in Combat Hapkido, I believe I'll give the ICHF material a go while continuing to train the SFC material.

Once again, I appreciate that both you and JimH have taken the time to reply to this topic.

SIGnoramus

[JimH]

Hapkido,Jujitsu,Aikido,Judo any joint manipulation art should ALWAYS start with strikes,Atemi,softening of the opponent.

The only way a person is going to be able to pull off a joint manipulation move as a first move is if the attacker is smaller,weaker,out of it or the victim is able to throw the technique as a surprise.

I always tell the students when I teach that everyone says in order to use a joint manipulation or a throw you must have a compliant partner.
I say ,I agree,we hurt the opponent to the point that they DO WILLINGLY COMPLY.

The majority of Defenses in Combat Hapkido always have a strike ,a softening at the start of the technique.

In regards to the ICHF Unarmed against the knife ,there are drills to pass the knife ,but they are drills.
The actual techniques are fairly straight forward :
Parry and strike
Catch the limb and strike,then move for manipulation.
One thing that is stressed in actual training with GM P is to strike,and soften the opponent,strike as much as needed.
Striking is not gone into as much on the Video's/DVD's and Books as these are for refresher for current students in ICHF schools,and as general instruction for those looking to learn something from the DVD's.
The Video's,DVD's and Books all state that these are sample techniques,that the student should train at a school or at least attend a seminar in addition to using the DVD's,Books.

Again if training is from Video's and or DVD's and NOT a set school lesson plan,then mix and match techniques as you find they fit your needs.

[SIGnoramus]

JimH,

Thanks for that information. I know that you are an advanced student of Mr. Pellegrini's material and that is why I asked for input from you specifically.

There are a couple of ICHF affiliates fairly close to me and I will be contacting both of them this week. One of them teaches both Combat Hapkido and is an instructor under Hock. I guess he finds that they work well together for him.

Thanks again for your help.

SIGnoramus

[JimH]

Master Doyle is an example of an Instructor with Rank in several arts being able to teach them seperately as well as Blend them.
He is a Good choice as he is ranked in the arts you want plus others.
Good Luck