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[Joe Hubbard]

Actually, I remember an article written a few years back by Dr. Joseph Estwanik (former UFC medical consultant) talking about how Thai shin conditioning can lead to cancer.  The article mentioned many including Bas Rutten who have suffered from the over conditioning of their shins.  Estwanik has a great book called: Sports Medicine For the Combat Arts:
 
http://www.boxergenics.com/books.html

Check it out

Joe

[Hock]

Joe, out of curiosity...does the book mention...head butts or head injuries at all?

Hock

[Milldog1776]

That's the second clip of this type I have seen.  In the first one the guy countered with a shin block and miscaculated and countered with his knee and the kicker's shin broke in half the minute his foot landed on the floor.

This one looks as though it was just a standard Thai shin counter that resulted in the destruction.  Which ever way you look at it, you can only destroy a Thai kick if you know the appropiate counter-

First of all...that looked so painfull that my weiner turned inside out!!!

Second....I think it's the angle created by a leg that does a destruction against those types of kicks. A triangle is the strongest occuring geometric shape in nature. What shape is the destruction? Triangle right? What shape is the incoming kick? Just a theory, but I think that is a contributing factor.

[Scott]

I've seen a similar video some years ago. Here is a link to the discussion on rec.martial-arts about the match. Unfortunately, the link to the video doesn't work anymore as this video was much more dramatic and close up. Here's the discussion. Once you klick on this link, it'll takes a few seconds to go to the discussion. http://makeashorterlink.com/?Q1F334E8B

Since the shin is made up of two bones (fibula and tibula) and not one, both bones get broken. http://www.cathedral.org/wrs/quilla/fibula.htm

Scott

[Professor]

 What is healthy about rolling bottles up and down your shinbones to the point where you've killed all the nerve endings in your legs?  (I wonder if someone's ever done a long term study on the effects of such conditioning and arthritis related injuries etc with regards to Thai boxers and Muy Thai guys?)

Finally, there's just so many other viable targets and weapons in a real fight (I think) that I don't see the need to resorting to planting my shin bone against someone elses.  Hard targets/soft weapons or soft targets/hard weapons.

Nick

There are many other arts that "condition" their body parts by killing the nerves.   There have been many studies in the long term effects of hand, finger conditioning.....

I had a friend who did this for many years and had trouble holding a glass....not a pretty picture.

[Joe Hubbard]

Hi Hock

Dr. Estwanik covers head injury, but mostly from the vantage point of receiving a blow and not delivering the blow as in the case of the head butt.  He does however concur on all the data that you have presented in relation to “head injury” (most references in the book are in relation to a boxing match or MMA competition with rules). 

He describes the brain floating in a rock solid vault called the skull.  He also uses the analogy of a yolk (brain) suspended in its’ shell (skull).   One doesn’t have to crack the egg so to speak to cause irreparable damage to the brain.  Shaking the egg violently can scramble the yolk without cracking the shell.  On the other hand, a sharp tap to the edge of a frying pan can open the shell without breaking the yolk.  He says, “ Punches, kicks, head butts or elbows delivered to the head produces a sudden acceleration which shakes and scrambles the yolk within its’ shell.  This scrambling interferes with the transmission of nerve impulses, short circuiting the brain cells, leading to an altered state of consciousness.”

With all of our anatomy used as offensive weapons, the primary target for destruction is the opponent’s head- most systems agree with this!  With that in mind, if we are using the head as a primary tool, it goes to say that we are gambling severe injury that could result in a continuum of death from Dementia Pugilistica (punch drunk) all the way up to Epidural Hematoma (high pressure blood clot to the brain).

Cheers

Joe

[Hock]

Thanks, Joe...

From broken legs to broken brains.
Again, I have NEVER met a medical person who would in any way argue for head butt.

I have stumbled upon a police textbook (translate that to BIG $$$$$) on police injuires from fights, stabbings and shootings, and I will have to bite the bullet and buy it.

Hey, I think someone sent me the first famous broken leg video and we'll try to load it up on the video clip page asap...

Hock

[arnold]

In the words of the late Rex Applegate, " Get the biggest pair of boots you can and kick the shit out of him" Met Rex at a soldier convention a few years back with Hock. According to Hock , we sort of looked alike. Hopefully Hock still has the picture
RIP Rex Applegate

[Splat!]

Which ever way you look at it, you can only destroy a Thai kick if you know the appropiate counter- most on the street don't.  I prefer to use the knee destruction rather than the shin block. 

Hi Joe,

Could you please elaborate on techniques for Thai kick counters/destructions?

Thanks,

Splat!

[Hock]

Counters to kicks, Thai or otherwise...

Marc Halleck shows his entire Filipino kick-counter series in Panantukan Silat Level 7

http://www.hockscqc.com/shop/product41.html

Pretty handy having all these together in one presentation: counters front thrusts, side kicks, snaps, low, medium and high round kicks.

Hock