Hock Hochheim's Combat Talk Forum

General Category => Gun Fighting => Topic started by: VicMackey on January 19, 2008, 09:25:43 PM

Title: 2nd Time I've Seen the Elephant
Post by: VicMackey on January 19, 2008, 09:25:43 PM
This one, it finally ended in death. I had to shoot a feral dog in self-defense w/ one shot from my H&K USP .40 as it tried to lunge towards me. Since it was clear-cut self-defense, no investigation was needed and I got my pistol back after a records check by the responding officer, who even treated me like another brother officer. I thought at first that I was gonna get treated as a criminal and go though the legal machine. I did everything by the book, kept calm, and appeared non-threatening. I also had my CH permit at the time of the shooting. Good thing I practiced CQ shooting, which was of great help for this situation. This is what I experienced as what most have experienced after the shot was fired:
1. Auditory Exclusion (The .40 pistol I fired sounded more like a firecracker because of the adrenaline dump)
2. Rapid Heartbeat (still kept my breathing controlled, though)
3. Mark of Cane Complex (Had some remorse since the animal didn't knew right from wrong. Also couldn't forget the graphic images and the 15 sec. suffering the deceased dog went through.)
4. Sleeplessness (I woke up after 5 hrs. and it took me 3 hrs. to go into a deep sleep)
5. Everything seemed to go so fast, instead of slow motion.

Things That Others Experienced I Didn't Go Through:
1. loss of appetite
2. uncontrolled crying/brooding
3. chastisement from friends/family
4. uncontrolled shaking/diarrhea of the mouth
5. nightmares (dream of the adversary coming back to life)
6. fine loss of motor skills
7. loss of bowel control
8. tunnel vision
9. depression/lack of interest in leisure or hobbies/sex
10. events seeming to move in slow motion

Ways to Cope:
1. Talking it out with someone you trust.
2. Trusting in your faith that God or some higher being understands and is forgiving.
3. Accepting the fact that you have to sometimes take a life to protect yourself and your actions are justifiable.
4. Being grateful that you survivied.
5. Positive self-talk.
6. intense, physical training
7. humor
8. sex (lots of it)
 
Title: Re: 2nd Time I've Seen the Elephant
Post by: FredVS on January 19, 2008, 10:26:25 PM
You're kidding right? It was a wild dog!  If killing a wild dog equates to 'seeing the elephant'
Then perhaps I should relate to you the time I sprung an deadly ambush on two count em two racoons stealing dog food from an open container I left outside but the memories are simply to fresh and painful, maybe someday I'll have closure.
Title: Re: 2nd Time I've Seen the Elephant
Post by: Trainer on January 21, 2008, 06:30:54 PM
we are here for you brother, let it out.

reminds me of the time I had to use lethal force on a misquito that bit me
Title: Re: 2nd Time I've Seen the Elephant
Post by: loyalonehk on January 21, 2008, 08:10:45 PM
I believe this is a good time to release the OLD H.T.F.U. post again...  LOL

To each his own.

I don't mean to make light of your experience...  You might have PTSD and need to seek professional help. 

Good luck and hang tough...

 :o

PS
Kinda reminds me of the time I was on the berm outside Camp Gannon by the Syrian border at night.  The men and I that were in our fighting hole got to watch a pack of wild dogs fight off a stray from another pack of wild dogs through our NVG's and PAS-13 (aka Terminator vision).  We were all cocked, locked and ready to rock.  One of the wild dogs got so close I almost had to break cover and let hell loose.  True story...   ;)

I can still hear the barks sometimes at night...
(http://i211.photobucket.com/albums/bb35/Webster-KajuPit/DocsPicsHusayba010.jpg)
Title: Re: 2nd Time I've Seen the Elephant
Post by: loyalonehk on January 21, 2008, 08:31:17 PM
The next morning we quickly took turns marking our territory...   :D

OK, I'll stop now.  Love, Peace and Chicken...

(http://i211.photobucket.com/albums/bb35/Webster-KajuPit/DocsPicsHusayba053.jpg)
Title: Re: 2nd Time I've Seen the Elephant
Post by: whitewolf on January 23, 2008, 06:52:24 PM
Vic-I dont know if this is ajoke or a true story-if it is true you need some professional guidance and quickly i  might add-a dog-are u shitting me-----here is a dog story for you-its 1968 (yes 68) I am in Nam with  the Marines-we are over run in the compound with wild dogs-I try to get permission to shoot them with shotgun-answer is no-so some of my gung ho troops get the idea to pick up a dog (weighed about 40  lbs and put him in the fire barrel filled with  water and cover the top with a piece of wood-the dog would not stay down and even though 3  Marines tried to  keep the cover on he kept sticking his  head out-one of my  guys picked up a entrenching tool and bong hit it on the head-the dog went under this  time-they  told me we  could not do  that either-so i said screw it and let  them run-no one got post t s over this-no one got a purple heart -we just  kept trucking on-semper fi- whitewolf..
Title: Re: 2nd Time I've Seen the Elephant
Post by: rasdj on January 23, 2008, 07:21:24 PM
perhaps it was a 2nd run in with a dog named elephant?
Title: Re: 2nd Time I've Seen the Elephant
Post by: Nick Hughes on January 23, 2008, 10:03:44 PM
I'm not sure if it's a gag post or not but my initial reaction was wondering if you shoot a feral elephant would it be called "seeing the dog?"

Yer Uncle Nicky
Title: Re: 2nd Time I've Seen the Elephant
Post by: whitewolf on January 23, 2008, 11:22:55 PM
Nick-you slay  me-i cant stop laughing- i reread that post vic sent-if i  could i would have put the ferl dog in the water barrel  also- Bong-its all over except the uraaaaaas from my platoon-you know us jar  heads -it dont take much to make us laugh-stay  safe-whitewolf
Title: Re: 2nd Time I've Seen the Elephant
Post by: arnold on January 24, 2008, 06:40:10 AM
What about shooting a feral roo? Do you get an award, a medal, lunch at Arby's? A table dance in Amish country?
Had the pit bull chow mix across the street come after one of my 3 pound terrorist attack dogs. Cracked him over the noggin with the pick handle that I keep handy at the front door ( ya just never know when a pack of young Mormons on bikes or a pack of Jehovah's witnesses might show up). I always give them tea and tell them it's caffeine free!
Knocked the dog out cold. He shrugged it off after about 20 minutes. To this day he will not crap in my yard and if he seems me slinks away. I've had a likeness of the Nickster painted on the mailbox. Slows down a great deal of the junk mail.
I've seen the elephant, or the dog, or the roo, ah who knows what the hell I've seen.
Saw a Werewolf drinking a pina colada at trader Vick's. And his hair was perfect!
Title: Re: 2nd Time I've Seen the Elephant
Post by: whitewolf on January 24, 2008, 10:54:58 AM
Arnold-Damm son-you should  have barbacued the dog-wrapped him up  and sent to to vietnam-they  would  have   loved the taste-as far as a ferl roo-i personally like little roo roos-are they safe to  have as a pet??  Maybe we should start a roo roo farm  here in the desert in kuwait-would they  go  over-dont know but who  knows what lurks in the minds of men?? I know i have gone over the f----g edge--who gives a shit-seya sir-semper f--g fi-whitewolf..-oh  dam-say hello to  Mr Nick for me--
Title: Re: 2nd Time I've Seen the Elephant
Post by: Dawg on January 24, 2008, 01:25:32 PM
ROFLMAO ;D ;D
You haven't gone over the edge Whitewolf; you just barbecued your brain on that last patrol in the hot Kuwaiti sun! "Roo-roos"! Freakin' hilarious!
Try to find some shade, will ya? ::)
Title: Re: 2nd Time I've Seen the Elephant
Post by: Bryan Lee on January 26, 2008, 04:55:18 AM


(EDITED FOR ADULT CONTENT)
Title: Re: 2nd Time I've Seen the Elephant
Post by: VicMackey on January 27, 2008, 09:49:38 AM
I fine, guys. I've accepted that stuff like this happens. The first time I had a similar situation like this was from a charging/barking pit bull, which got hit by a moving van before it got a chance to attack me from across the street. I already had that same pistol out and was ready to fire at that time. The van didn't stop since the driver probably was scared s***less and thought the dog was working in unison with me. I came back the 2nd day after the attack and saw that same dog, this time in a locked fence, go about it's business as if nothing happened. No marks or anything. Again, this is just from a previous situation. And the most recent incident where I fired my same .40 pistol in self-defense, was no joke. I appreciate the humor you guys put in this. But from a legal standpoint, would a warning shot fired to the ground have been more appropriate? I just don't want to discharge a firearm within city limits for no reason and would hate to explain and prove to the responding officer that I fired a warning shot to the ground and scared off the attacking dog. Also, it's a waste of ammo, especially Federal 165-gr. Hydrashock. I have even used OC against that same attacking dog I shot in self-defense prior to and still didn't faze it.
Title: Re: 2nd Time I've Seen the Elephant
Post by: Nick Hughes on January 27, 2008, 09:58:07 AM
Er...Vic,

The reason the guys are using humor is they can't tell if you're serious or not...

The phrase seeing the elephant refers to battle and warfare...

Quote
One phrase familiar in enlisted men's writings is, "I've seen the elephant," or, "I'm off to see the elephant." Used to describe the experiences of war and soldiering, the term has many possible origins.


Shooting a puppy dog can hardly be considered as an act of war or battle...hence our confustion.

Yer Uncle Nick
Title: Re: 2nd Time I've Seen the Elephant
Post by: VicMackey on January 27, 2008, 10:03:28 AM
As for the dog from the most recent incident, I couldn't exactly identify what breed it was. It's not a rot, dobe, or even a pit. It's just some black dog that was fairly large. It sure wasn't friendly either and was growling. I've had some stray dogs approach me in the past and I give them a good pat and move on. I can usually tell a friendly dog by it wagging it's tail and sticking out its tongue. I generally love dogs and I used to own a dog myself (Samoyed). It's just some go bad and I have to do what I have to do to protect myself or any innocent party. Had that black stray dog backed away after I barked commands at it to sit, heel, or even go away, it wouldn't have happened. I even tried to resolve it to the lowest level by calling Animal Control. But those clowns never showed up at all. So I had to deal with it myself. Better it than me.
Title: Re: 2nd Time I've Seen the Elephant
Post by: VicMackey on January 27, 2008, 10:06:10 AM
I was serious, guys. Sorry for the misunderstanding. I thought that seeing the elephant meant being in a situation where you had to defend yourself for real, anything that induces adrenaline stress. Let's just call this a dog incident.
Title: Re: 2nd Time I've Seen the Elephant
Post by: whitewolf on January 27, 2008, 11:33:05 AM
Vic-dont get upset you got to  be able to take it on this forum or the roo roo will kick your ass-I work tonight out in town so ill look for a f----g dog and run over his ass-i  hate these MF over  here (they are so  cute -but-------too much  sun  has fried their  brains (like mine)-semper fi  whitewolf.. ;D ;D ;D
Title: Re: 2nd Time I've Seen the Elephant
Post by: VicMackey on January 27, 2008, 02:51:31 PM
I'm not upset. I was just answering the question about whether this topic I came up with was either for real or just a joke. It's cool.
Title: Re: 2nd Time I've Seen the Elephant
Post by: whitewolf on January 27, 2008, 11:17:11 PM
Vic-no problem here life is to  short to  panic over our bullshit -we just  like to enjoy -oh -i just  got  home from work-i did not see any cute  dogs to  do  bodily harm to so they are safe for another 12 hours-then back out there to continue the hunt.. :D :D ;D
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