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Author Topic: Jim Wagner, Romance, and the Missing Ad?  (Read 9749 times)

Hock

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Jim Wagner, Romance, and the Missing Ad?
« on: July 10, 2008, 03:36:50 PM »

I put this here, because I believe Jim Wagner needs equal, fair time. But, warning...it does seem to include a Ron Baliki-esque Style romance story...? Wha?



Wagner recalls me, recalling and then explains I am wrong...

“I first heard of him when he advertised in old Black belt, (late 
80s? early 90s?) using a photo of him and Dan Inosanto (taken at a 
seminar). He was flogging himself with Dan…misleading…and making the 
Inosanto community mad for a period, not allowing any seminar 
pictures with Dan for years. Thanks to Jimbo, he set a pattern of 
suggestively making himself what he is not.”

Now we come to outright lies. First of all I never advertised in 
Black Belt in the late 80’s or early 90’s. My first HIGH RISK article 
came out in 1999 thanks to Editor Robert Young who took a chance on 
me. You have to keep in mind that when I first approached Black Belt 
magazine there were no articles in any martial arts magazine around 
the world about terrorism, the use-of-force continuum, using air 
guns, stage blood for knife training, virtually nothing about 
criminal tactics, nothing on school shootings or snipers taking a pop 
shots. It was all about the traditional martial arts and a story here 
and there about the new UFC. My HIGH RISK articles in Black Belt 
magazine, and then in Budo in Europe, opened the door to the many 
people on the reality-based band wagon that you see now when you open 
up a martial arts magazine anywhere in the world. It took me ten years to get my ideas out there, but now there is no stopping it. 

But, going back to the late 80’s and 90’s, no, I was not advertising.

I first met Dan Inosanto in 1977 at the Aspen Academy of Martial Arts 
for a solid month of training. Jeet Kune Do and Filipino Kali were 
virtually unknown then. That same year Dan told Black Belt magazine 
that he feared that Filipino would die out. Of course it didn’t, and 
he is credited for reviving it and making Jeet Kune Do popular. I got 
to hear the stories about Bruce Lee and the history of the Philippine 
martial arts because Dan gave me a lift each morning from my hotel 
room to the training site 20 minutes away.

At the Aspen Academy of Martial Arts Dan’s first wife approached me 
and told me that her daughter, Diana Lee Inosanto, had a crush on me 
and if I would be willing to take her to the dance that the Academy 
was having on the last day. I was 16 years old, she was 14, and it 
was a nice pleasant one-time date.

Dan found out that I lived in California only 45 minutes south of his 
school and he invited me to train at the Filipino Kali Academy in 
Torrance. From 1977 to 1980 I tried to go up as often as I could. 
Usually it was twice a week. It was great because sometimes there 
would only be a few of us, and we’d get a lot of individual attention.

When I went into the United States Army Dan wrote me a letter, which 
I have kept to this day. He was always an encourager and I never once 
heard a negative thing come out of his mouth.

After the Army I hooked up with Ted Lucay Lucay; another popular JKD 
and Filipino Kali instructor at the time under Dan Inosanto. After 
several months with him I started teaching Jeet Kune Do and Filipino 
Kali privately for a few years and dropped in occasionally at Dan’s 
new school, Inosanto Academy, located in Marine Del Ray (near the Los 
Angeles International Airport).

In 1987 I was teaching Jeet Kune Do and Filipino Kali out of my home 
in Orange, California. However, shortly after I started blending some 
of my military training with several other systems I had studied over 
the years. Eventually this was all to evolve into the Jim Wagner 
Reality-Based Personal Protection system on January 21, 2003.

 From time to time a mutual student would tell me that Dan “gives his 
regards.” Over the years I simply lost contact with my former 
teacher. Yet, I credit him for his revolutionary ideas back then 
which laid the foundations for me to eventually start the reality-
based self-defense movement.

It would have probably have been a good idea for this well-known 
instructor to have contacted Dan Inosanto or Diana Lee Inosanto 
before going public and making accusations that I was “misleading.” 
The only one I believe to be omni present is God Almighty. Yet, this 
instructor seems to think that he knows all of my relationships and 
my motivations. There is definitely some “misleading” going on, but 
it is not coming from me."

<<<<<<>>>>>>>

And there you have it boys and girls...is Wagner's reply.
I just would not make that up for fun. I did not and would not make a lie on you, there Sgt Jim. This is what I remember. If I am wrong, I'll be the first to admit it. So now..you all readers decide. We report. You decide. (see the ad below) Not sure how God Almighty got into this?

Sgt. Jim, you came on real strong about this unimportant one? And with just a whole heaping mountain of extra side junk and you even got in there a little Wagnerism-

"It was great because sometimes there would
only be a few of us, and we’d get a lot of individual attention."

There it is. That is a Wagnerism, that obsessive, inserted compulsion to pad-extra and advertise your special training and skills. You are good, man. You are good. But, you could of said to me, "Hock's is dead wrong, I never advertised before 1999." 

Anyway, we also got through that romance story, you handsome, irresistable lover boy you. Next let's get to something important, like those 140 Counter Terrorism missions...NO SWAT TEAM, and his true HHS International connection, and those questions on the other thread. 

Hock


 
« Last Edit: June 01, 2009, 08:47:41 PM by Hock »
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Hock

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Re: Wagner, Romance , and disclaimer
« Reply #1 on: July 11, 2008, 07:47:24 PM »

For example. Ron Baliki just emailed me and said the cute story is an over-exaggarated, over-blown tale. As Ron said,

"The part I find funny is that he uses that little event as some kind of credentials to being legit with an Inosanto credential." Its obvious padding. Ron got it right away. Its padding.

Ron later confirmed as far as Wagner being an Inosanto Instructor, "no he is not." As Wagner told JIMH he was one in 2003. Nor has ever been. Nor had he been Dan's daily commuting buddy to the school.

They also asked Dan Inosanto today about the "looove connection" - who said -

"Oh, I think I remember that. You (Diana) wanted to go to the party and he offered to
 escort you." After thinking about it,  Diana said she did remember the
 event but that is about it."

But this is ridiculous to even talk about this date or mention this date in the context of this subject. It is padding and distraction and even ridiculous for Wagner to even bring the story up. It is a trick side-step to dodge the ad, and he will seriously regret calling me liar and a msileader on this and other things...worldwide.


Hock
« Last Edit: June 01, 2009, 08:49:31 PM by Hock »
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Hock

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Re: Jim Wagner, Romance, and the Missing Ad?
« Reply #2 on: July 12, 2008, 10:03:02 PM »

So here is the ad Wagner said I lied about and doesn't exist.





In another ad for this very tape? No Dan Inosanto added, but says he has 13 years in SWAT and Special Forces?  http://www.amazon.com/Becoming-Cop-DVD-Sgt-Wagner/dp/B0007YN6UK  (The text saying this was taken down but we have it recorded for you down below.)

Sgt Jim Wagner never even on a Swat Team. He was an "office helper/support" and was released from the job and replaced by an unarmed, untrained park ranger.
http://hockscombatforum.com/index.php/topic,4084.0.html


This is the ad I mentioned that many Inosanto instructors felt abused Dan Inosanto, took advantage of him, the one that he claims I lied about and doesn't exist. I just had the wrong year. He jumped right on that technicality like...well...kinda' like you might expect someone like he would jump, like a con man in a three-card monte game. Playing "the Dodge" until the bitter end.

Emailing several top Inosanto people that I know in the last three days, just after Wagner called me a liar on international talk forums as far as Australia,  several Inosanto people told me that this was the type photo abuse has happened several times. Wagner is but one of them, but in the late 1990s, as I first guessed the year wrong.

Dan's people are very protective of him and they themselves as certified instructor's use Dan's photo gingerly out of respect, or they do not use Dan's picture. Wagner has never even been certified by Guro dan Inosanto. Wagner is but one of thousands of people that have walked through the Inosanto Acadmeny, maybe even 100 thousand people since it started four decades ago?

It seems Ron Baliki had to shake the cobwebs out of Guru Dan's and Diania's head just to even recall who Wagner was. His mug on Black Belt Magazine helped.

And before Snow Flake tries to skidmark around this ad by saying he had permission to use Dan's photo? it will be easliy checked with Guro Dan probably within 48 hours, if he is home this weekend.

****

This ad photo caused one of several ruckus-es through time about who Dan is photographed with at seminars. For periods of time, instructors/hosts would not allow common photos with Dan. People constantly ask to be in a photos with him. He's Elvis for God's sake. I have several myself. Never use them in my bio because I have been gunshy about it, knowing these political problems. I don't think a good-natured guy like Dan cared, and the no-photo, campaigns disolved a bit through time. Then picked up again, then disolved. The common consensus among all these top Inosanto intructors is that they laugh Wagner off as an odd, wannabe joke.

I wonder how many of you out there have been told in person, in a seminar that Wagner was an Inosanto instructor? Like JIMH heard?

I wonder how may of you out there have been told by Wagner that he was an NCO in the Army, or were lead on to assume he was in the army a reasonable, normal, respectable amount of time? Like JimH heard. Or a door-kicker/trigger-puller, qualified SWAT team member? http://hockscombatforum.com/index.php/topic,4084.0.html

I wonder how many of you where led on to assume Wagner was a like a...a Jack Bauer/24 like, counter-terrorism agent as he says (post 911)? Like we all read.

Special Forces experience? That would be...what?

Hock
« Last Edit: April 04, 2016, 02:41:27 PM by Hock »
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Hock

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Re: Jim Wagner, Romance, and the Missing Ad?
« Reply #3 on: July 13, 2008, 07:59:20 AM »

DEA vet and long time southern Californian martial artist Jeff Clancy adds in another thread that I put here - Hock

"In 2003, Diana Inosanto initially said she had “never” heard of anyone called Jim Wagner; and never dated anyone by that name.  Then, a couple of days later, she said she does remember him and she went with him, and group of about 20 others, to a dance in Colorado; she was 12 at the time.  So much for the “crush” she had on him at age fourteen (according to JW).  JW has told many persons throughout the 1990s that he and Diana used to “date” one another."
                                                                           - Jeff Clancy, DEA




« Last Edit: June 01, 2009, 08:52:22 PM by Hock »
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JimH

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Re: Jim Wagner, Romance, and the Missing Ad?
« Reply #4 on: July 15, 2008, 06:42:35 PM »

Product description of Jim Wagners Becoming a COP Video:
(taken from POWNET)

Taught by Sgt. Jim Wagner, creator of the Reality Based Personal Protection system. A police officer with over 13 years experience in SWAT, Corrections, Special Forces, and the Military, Wagner has taught hundreds of police courses world-wide, including Brazil, Argentina, Israel, FBI and CIA. This video will teach you, step by step, everything you ever wanted to know about combat with a knife, and other edged weapons. The only way you're going to know how to defend against these grizzly weapons is to become and expert yourself, and that's what you will learn in this DVD. You will learn the 12 angles of attack and how to counter them, speed and reaction drills, prison yard methods, and more important, transition to your sidearm during a suprise knife attack. You'll lean how to not get SHANKED. Approx. 93 mins.

There it is Jim's claim of EXPERIENCE IN SPECIAL FORCES .
Special Forces in the US Military refers to ONE Unit and One Unit Only the US Army Special Forces,men who wear the Green Beret,period.

I would like to see that certificate on his web page.

So much crammed into 8 months.
Basic training, Comms school and then the... Special Forces Qualification Course.

<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Mr. Wagner, (on this forum) I asked about a membership card
You have listed now on your site a Filipino/Kali membership card.
Jim Wagner Class II member 1979, Head Instructor Dan Inosanto
Your Class Instructor Bustillo.
I have found out that the Class II membership does in fact mean that you joined  as a Twice a week member and you were ASSIGNED to BUSTILLO's Class.
Class II membership was no ranking as some were allowed to Assume.

« Last Edit: December 03, 2008, 12:12:16 PM by Hock »
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arnold

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Re: Jim Wagner, Romance, and the Missing Ad?
« Reply #5 on: October 07, 2011, 04:50:43 PM »

Only 140 missions?! Fucking weenie!
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I leave you idiots alone for 5 minutes and I come back and you're all dancing around like a bunch of Kansas City faggots
you're all a bunch of slack jawed faggots around here, this stuff will make you a sexual tyrannosaurus, just like me!

JimH

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Re: Jim Wagner, Romance, and the Missing Ad?
« Reply #6 on: October 07, 2011, 09:52:30 PM »

JW claims the 140 Missions,(uneventful rides in aircraft),were done in 1 year.
The reality is JW was not a Sky marshal for a year and actually flew around 3-4 months,so if he claimed 140 rides in a year,I would guess he flew MUCH less than 140 flights,in actuality.
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whitewolf

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Re: Jim Wagner, Romance, and the Missing Ad?
« Reply #7 on: October 07, 2011, 11:06:53 PM »

I reread the previous threads dating back awhile-in one it said he did everything in the world in 8 months-Did that include going to the potty-
 ;D-WW
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JimH

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Re: Jim Wagner, Romance, and the Missing Ad?
« Reply #8 on: October 08, 2011, 06:59:30 AM »

There is an interesting report about the Sky Marshals out that says:
After 911 the Government was so eager to get bodies the vetting system almost ignored and people hired and let go as vetted,just to get people in the seats.
Training was reduced from 12 weeks to 6 weeks to get more people in quickly.
In the first year the program went from pre 911 of 32 Sky Marshals to 1000.
In the first year there were around 750 complaints made against the Sky Marshals for Sleeping and Being Drunk while on duty,as well as OTHER infractions.
By the end of the first year 250 Sky marshals were let go and or resigned.(JW was one )
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JohnS

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Re: Jim Wagner, Romance, and the Missing Ad?
« Reply #9 on: October 09, 2011, 12:01:51 AM »

Hock,I want to get a psychologist friend of mine to register here and do a profile of Officer Wagner based upon his writings.This guy is buggy baloo.
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